Doug Ahlgren
Summary of February 25 discussion
Indians as Slaves--Questions:
Why do you think the tribes in Brazil and the Carolinas were unable
to unite against the European settlers?
Doug thought the tribes played off each other.
Robert thought rivalries existed in Carolinas. He also
thought the Europeans wanted to maintain trade partnerships, and that
the Indians didn’t know what to think about the colonists.
Sara thought the colonists were more mobile giving them
the ability to distribute their own formulated messages.
Professor George R. Spangler, asked the class to compare
Ishi with the lack of cohesion along coast, the language barriers evolve
very quickly even in small areas.
The Portuguese used the Indian revolts as an excuse to begin taking
slaves. Do you think that they would have found a different excuse
eventually or was this just an unfortunate turn in history that sparked
the idea of Indian slavery?
Doug asked, the Portuguese used Indian labor in the
beginning, is this what they intended the whole time?
Yeng said throughout history people have had slaves.
Zach added that different cultures will clash when a
larger group takes over a smaller group.
Margaret thought that the slaves were a necessity to
build the Portuguese economy.
Sara thought the options were limited with what to do
with the people.
Elisa thought the Portuguese depended on the Indians
for their economy and would have employed them in some way if they were
not taken as slaves.
Professor George R. Spangler asked if the Indians used
in Northern California as slaves during the gold rush?
Robert asked if European hunters were selling Indians for work in Northern
California?
Professor George R. Spangler stated that the Indians wouldn’t
work so African American labor was used. He then asked where did California
of 1800 find labor to build infrastructure?
Robert, China?
Professor George R. Spangler, yes.
Do you see any parallels to this idea of accidental economic dependence
on slavery in our modern society?
Doug brought up the comparison of sweet shops.
Margaret told a story about China Town in NY selling
twenty shirts for ten dollars, she then elaborated on the real cost of
goods and how surprised she was to find this anomaly of the market.
Robert talked about NAFTA briefly and US trade agreements.
Professor George R. Spangler talked about the candidates
calling for economic policy for the protection of labor and the environment.
Margaret has never heard of NAFTA but wonders how we
can improve the system.
Professor George R. Spangler talks about the ethical
problems between cheap goods and correctly produced goods in the
global economy.
Margaret wonders why people buy dangerous toys when
we know they are dangerous?
Jason compares the situation to the tragedy of the commons,
cheap labor being the common good that is and always ahs been exploited
throughout history. He added the market failures of correctly pricing
goods based on how much destruction they cause to society and the environment.
Professor George R. Spangler explained the idea of tragedy
of the commons and added his thoughts about open access to labor and
resources in the global economy.
Gregory talked about his personal responsibility in
using chemical fertilizers and thought more people should also take responsibility
for what chemicals they use on the soil.
Professor George R. Spangler concurred with Gregory
stating people should exercise judgment when it comes to protecting the
environment.
Berger seems to suggest that the early system of Indian slavery
set up the later demand for African slavery. Do you think this
is true or do you have any other insights on this idea?
Doug skipped this question because of time limitations
and the subject has already been touched on during an early conversation.
Indians as Allies--Questions:
Why were the Iroquois so much more diplomatically astute than
the tribes in the Carolinas and Brazil?
Adam thought that being united and much larger with
common governments helped them express their views.
Robert thought Berger doesn’t give details about
other tribes other than the Iroquois, he thought other tribes were more
accomplished that Berger gives them credit for. He added the Chippewa
were located between many European colonies and used all for trade and
partnerships.
Professor George R. Spangler explained that history
teaches the Indians lost battles as Europeans marched west, and eventually
losing everything. This however is very much not true, closer study revels
negotiated agreements between the Europeans and Indians and the Europeans
not following thru on them.
Margaret asked how the Indians chose which alliances
would be beneficial.
Professor George R. Spangler said they were based on
size and furthermore self-sufficiency, their ability to produce trade
goods.
This is where the discussion ended due to class time expiring.
How did the Iroquois exploit the rivalries between the British
and French in order to pursue their own goals?
In what way did the result of the French and Indian War effect the future of the Iroquois?
If the Iroquois had sided with the United States in the Revolutionary War and or the War of 1812 do you think this would have changed their position in history?
Why do you think the Iroquois League became so fragmented by the end of the War of 1812?
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Date created: January 10, 2000
Last modified: March 2008
Copyright © 2008, George R. Spangler